As always, your writing is wonderful. "...a long and in appropriate finger up the border." Soccer fields, parking lots, lights... ridiculous. This is a great piece of wild land that must be kept as it is. Keep fighting the fight!

Great piece, Karin. Hahamongna is a special place. Few cities have anything like it and we should do everything we can to keep it as it is. I'll correct you on one thing: Hahamongna is a piece of heaven worth A LOT of hell.

The percentage of people who would use an outdoor recreational facility in Pasadena is huge. I recommend they keep the hiking and horse trails, add cross country course, archery, tennis courts (where are Pasadena's public courts?), sports fields, and a community pool.

I think an important factor from the point of view of a city, maintaining soccer fields etc...Hahamonga is a WATERSHED area...prone to floods. Not a good mix with soccer fields and parking lots. Given that city councils often don't listen to the community who wants something to stay the same, but instead wants to create something shiny and new to point at and say, "see, we did that"...I think it would be prudent to highlight this aspect of the area and how that would be a longterm financial drain on Pasadena in the long run. And is that really the best use of the financial resources of Pasadena? Nature generally wins, even after politicians have their way...

Thanks Karen, for writing this! Besides Hahamongna's value for flood control, a natural watershed, and passive recreation, it has unique cultural/historical value. Native Americans used the Arroyo Seco as a highway, along which villages were sited. At Hahamongna, the highway culminated in both a permanent and seasonal settlements where native people came to collect acorns and to access their main trade route through Millard Canyon and the San Gabriels. It is so special to have such wild open land with so much amenity accessible to us urbanites — why would the city even think of using it for soccer or to park Rose Bowl overflow? At so many meetings over the years I have attended on Hahamongna, both Pasadenans and Altadenans have overwhelmingly said "HANDS OFF!" to the city — just leave it alone. The city backs off, but soon comes back, thinking eventually to wear people down. The original vote to put soccer fields there was taken past midnight, when tired people had gone home, thinking there would be no more action items. I drive by the new and intelligently sited soccer fields on N. Fair Oaks at least twice a week. I always check to see if they are being used and 19 times out of 20 the answer is no — which belies the argument that our youth are woefully under served and being denied access to playing fields. The other erroneous argument is that every square inch of the city has been examined, and NOT ONE other site exists for soccer fields.

Hahamongna should be left alone. Isn't it enough that there are soccer fields near the Rose Bowl, on N. Fair Oaks, and near PHS? Not all of them are used with any consistency, so why make more? Not everything has be "graded, sectioned off, or paved over" to be beautiful. Leave the watershed natural and find somewhere else to spend the mone if it is burning a hole in the city's pocket.

"But in the end, it's like walking into the middle of an old family argument, where no matter how reasonable your case, there's one side that retreats to the bar and refuses to listen." Too true, as we witnessed at the last City Council meeting about the soccer fields - though to be fair, some of the more enlightened councilors did listen and act (just not enough to win the vote).

In Hahamongna yesterday I met a large (harmless) gopher snake, almost collided with a merlin in full chase, admired a red-shouldered hawk circling above, and saw bunnies and ground squirrels. Please, Pasadena, leave this lovely land alone as much as possible.

It's those "fingers"--many of which make no sense to the new resident--which make Pasadena such a varied place.

But yes, keep this area as wild as possible. It's the responsible--Pasadenan--thing to do.

Thankfully, Hahamongna has some very brilliant friends. They speak at city council meetings and are not intimidated when when half the council members, clearly, never had the least intention of listening to public statements.

Many of us go to Hahamonga because we need wild spaces, unpredictable surfaces, plants, trees, flowers, running wild water, birds, small mammals, deer, bumblebees and the occasional coyote and bobcat. We live nearby because it is there and easy to access, and it gives us what we can't find in the urban/suburban landscape.

The Station fire took 250 square miles of habitat from our treasured wildlife, and those that survived have been compressed into what little remains. The plans for soccer fields will not make their life better; it will remove one more option for their existence.

For more than two months I spoke almost daily with anyone encountered in Hahamongna — and only two individuals out of at least 400 thought that the soccer park was a good plan. Most of the people I spoke with were shocked that such an idea had been proposed, much less accepted by the city of Pasadena.

In the case of Hahamongna, based on the people who use and appreciate the area as it is, there is no doubt in my mind that the majority people do not want a soccer field.

The online petition at http://www.savehahamongna.org does a good job in describing the reasons for preservation through diverse writers.

The majority of people who love Hahamongna as it is — a haven for people and wildlife.

Marnie Gaede

My impression, having covered many of these meetings for the Star News, is that there has been some change among the Pasadena City Council (as well as some city commission members) about what Hahamongna should be. It has gone from most of the members supporting soccer fields, to a closely divided situation. The last vote to get rid of the soccer fields stalled with a 4-4 vote, a big difference from the thinking even two years ago.

Unfortunately, these kinds of conflicts are inevitable in an area with a shortage of both parks and natural open space, and that very aptly describes Southern California.

Not to disagree with you Dan, but if some can't see other available spaces for athletic fields, it's because they're not looking. I believe it was Petrea who sent a letter to the council with many potential sites that would prove much more advantageous to the community.

Disagree away ; )

The interesting thing for me on this question is that when the last Hahamonga battle brewed up the Council had recently received another proposal for a soccer/sports field in the lot east of Pasadena High. My impression from talking to some of the parents, city offiicials etc. is that sports fields would still be in demand even if several more were built. I'm not sure how many more spots you could put a sports field in realistically in Pasadena, though I certainly do think it would be a good idea for Pasadena parks and rec people to figure that out (I'd also be interested to see Petrea's list of sites).

Of course, that in of itself is not a reason to cut into open space areas, but my point was that we don't have much space left in this area for anything, and there are still a lot of uses people want to see for what is remaining. That is why I think you will continue to see these types of conflicts in Southern California.

Who can resist "free" land? Certainly not a city council whose members are under extreme pressure to meet citizens' and campaign supporter's wish lists as they try to sop up red ink. Open space already owned by the city or county is generally the first place politicians look to satisfy public appetites for new services and amenities, the reasons for which usually are not evil. Often the new proposed uses are heart-warming good causes, which makes it difficult to resist the temptation to use "bonus" space. We have to value existing open space for the precious and rare thing it is in itself — especially when it is also a beautiful, natural, and historic area such as Hahamongna. All open space isn't created equal, of course, but public park space needs special guardians against those who see it as empty and "free of charge."

A few years ago there was a move to site a very good cause at the Cobb Estate; this was thankfully withdrawn when opposition pointed out that the land was given with the covenant that it be held in perpetuity as open space, without picnic tables, bathrooms, or parking spaces. Interpretive signs are more of a gray area — but again there was plenty of pressure to take the signs that the Audubon Society had (with every good intention) placed there when they became graffiti magnets because they are so accessible from North Lake Avenue. Placing a computer center at Charles White Park seemed a bad idea for the same reason, we need open space for itself.

Not to stick my nose in Pasadena business, even though their nose may be wandering into what I consider my backyard, but if the city council feels their citizens are squeezed as to parks and recreation space, what's with all the high-density apartment construction? Surely things will only get worse.

Might I add that those attending city council meetings include your neighbors farther south. Think Highland Park or legendary Arroyan Charles Lummis. What starts upstream flows through our community too. Keeping that in mind, I believe there are many dogs in this Pasadena adjacent fight.

I'm a Floridian, not a Denan, but I have felt the pain of having important tracts of land developed, and for absolutely no other reason than to allow a few to profit at the expense of many. I hope the soccer fields never come to pass. It would be a terrible shame.

"They pave paradise, put up a parking lot."

When will they learn?

We need to take the whole possibilty off the table. It has been sittong there so long it doesn't matter what other gravey or stuffing comes along with it. It's a development idea that is always going to STINK.

The question needs to vanish forever. How do we make that happen?

Perhaps there needs to be an inter-city town hall meeting on Hahamongna. Maybe you could also throw in discussion of the Pinecrest Gate situation, and any other open space issues that concern Pasadena, La Canada, Altadena, South Pas, etc. etc.

Further, it should be stressed, this is a public watershed and is supposed to be protected. It's not just of local interest even though it falls under local control. Protection of this Haha benefits the greater good and is not exclusive to the people that hike or kick balls around in there, no offense to hikers or horses or soccer players.

Since Pasadena owns most of this area that used to be a County facility called Oak Grove Park, (including "the annex" purchased most recently), they want to to pull it in to their city's Arroyo Seco Master Plan. They aren't really interested, other than listening politely at meetings, in what non-residents and surrounding communities think they should do with it. But I like your idea!

True, Michele. But my experience with the Pas City Council is if you show up in enough numbers to its public comment session enough times, eventually city officials will listen.

Also there are at least two council members who are very sympathetic to the Hahamongna as open space argument, and only one who is a totally unswayed proponent of the soccer fields. There are also upcoming elections that could tilt the equation as well.

The plus side for open-space advocates from Altadena is that there are also quite a few people from Pasadena who regularly follow the council's actions on this and already do show up to meetings.

We could form a coalition and have representation at city coucil meetings. Speakers that represent groups hold more sway with the council. Don't be so milktoasty and doormattish obout this. The onky thing that will stop Pasadena from this environmental disaster is a movement that extends beyond Pasadena.

ENVIRONMENTALISTS :

Let's get to work putting a group together. Let's get people from Florida, Washington DC, Sacramento, Altadena. We have allies on the council but we can't expect them to beat this drum for us... I don't want to hear anymore about it being someone else's business. It belongs to all of us.

Dan just mentioned ELECTIONS.

typos!

Michele you are a gem. I know you go to meetings. I've seen you there and I think I even heard you speak to the council, am I mistaken? So, whatever happened to this? I'm going to write to this site and ask that we all get a powpow happening.

http://www.savehahamongna.org/index.htm

To your comment, PI (and thanks for letting me breathe again), there's some brown underneath that green. If the high-density is built first, without considering where people will play and go to school, etc. , it can be a dangerous alternative.

Gimme that schnozz. The key is near transportation. Where people play? Maybe they ride their bike or Segway to the park. Haha mongna around there. The bus comes para esquela au lycee. N'ce pas?

Good point Patrizzi, and I second the motion you lead the charge to save the Haha. I'll carry the flag or play the Tuba or bring chips and dip. Just give me an assignment. (You can keep my nose, by the way. Mine works ok, but, aesthetically speaking, yours is much more attractive.)

From Arroyo Lover: Watershed Review - You can view at the assessment at http://www.arroyoseco.org/aswa.htm. Please leave your thoughts and comments.  Your input is vital as this information is shared with the City of Los Angeles, the City of Pasadena, Los Angeles County Public Works, and the US Army Corps of Engineers in support of the Corps' current work on its Arroyo Seco Feasibility Study for Habitat Restoration.

I'm glad to see the fire still raging in opposition against those soccer fields. I was at that July council meeting and heard the many eloquent, impassioned statements to save Hahamongna. And then I was shocked to watch the vote fail to do so. Karin, thanks for keeping this in the limelight with your signature hilarious and wicked wit. Count me in as a soldier in this fight. Patrizzi, lead the way!

Ms Patrizzi, these are great resources. As I recall from the last meeting, Chris Holden ended up the most vocal advocate of keepinig Hahamongna natural.

As Susan said, lead the way. (She's got the piccolo.)

And in a weird twist, Antonovich wonders why the ALTADENA TOWN COUNCIL has not weighed in? Get moving.

UPDATE on the latest:

http://lacanadaflintridge.patch.com/articles/new-hahamongna-route-option-would-drastically-cut-truck-traffic-2

"I know Hahamongna from all possible angles, including aerial and the one you can only appreciate when flat on your back."

Forgive me, I just now got the humor in what you wrote here. I was thrown because I know you are an airplane pilot. I see now what you are describing. Yes, I know the areal view of which you speak. I was once thrown from a horse with my feet still in the stirrups and the saddle still wedged between my legs. Up (way up) and over, bam! Into the mud, and thank heaven for soft landing spots. Darn horse! He just hated to be ridden. I should have heeded the stall master's warning.