I own Webster's Fine Stationers with my husband Scott, not Steve. We have had coupons sitting on our Community Table in the store since September, since the CofC program rolled out. We've had six coupons redeemed since then.

@Lori- Sorry for the mistake. Now corrected. Hope to hear more about the coupons as the word continues to be spread around Altadena.

Thank you, Dan!

It is hard to get people to change their shopping habits. What we will need is a concentrated marketing effort to get the message out to folks on why they should shop local and the choices they have to shop at locally. The business directory Patch has put together is a great start as it has the best listing I have ever seen of local businesses here in Altadena. However it is just a start, and more is needed, maybe Patch or other local news sources could profile a business a week to help get the message out there? Also business owners need to get out there an promote themselves too. Lori has done a great job with her efforts, but most other business have done very little. It would be nice if they could at minimum fill out their information on Google Places, Patch and similar sites so that people can easily locate them.

Daniel

Thank you, Daniel. I wish the other businesses would be more active as well. That old adage, success follows success, is very true and never more needed than now in Altadena. Of course, we'd need the Chamber of Commerce to lead by example. We're working on that, as you know.

Perhaps bringing it to community attention in a Town Council meeting (and bringing coupon books there as well) would help with getting the message out by word of mouth. I believe that the Chamber has a spot on the Agenda each month. Just a thought.

We'd be more than happy to do that, Diane....thank you for that great suggestion!

The only reason I have to shop in Altadena is if the business has something I want and need at an affordable price. Otherwise, I shop elsewhere.

The problem with this "shop local" mantra is (1) Pasadena and the surrounding communities ARE local, and (2) the Altadena businesses that obsess over this shop local campaign are the ones that are in trouble because they are not providing a good or service to the community that is better than their competition.

How many times do we hear the Rite Aid on Altadena Drive telling us to shop local? Never, and this is because Rite Aid offers the local consumer what they need and want at an affordable price. The Altadena businesses that keep telling us to shop local need to stop it and instead focus on the wants and needs of their customer base.

Also, another problem with Altadena is that it is mostly low income, so trendy niche businesses will have trouble surviving because there is not a sufficient customer base.

Daniel.......Good comments all. It is so hard to believe that people still live with the idea that Altadena is "mostly low income". Interestingly, I think that should be looked at because sometimes if that is what some people still think, then that attitude can be one that keeps businesses from coming here. What Altadena needs is a good PR team!

Well, if Altadena is not mostly low income then why are the most successful businesses in Altadena those that cater to that sector? Why are there so many payday loan stores, liquor stores, fast food joints, Arco gas stations, and nail salons? Also, the 2000 census was ten years ago. I just don't believe the numbers. Altadena is full of too many people that are in denial about where they live and instead live in an Altadena fantasy world. Too many people in Altadena that walk around with blinders on cooing about how hip, artsy, and trendy Altadena is, and how Altadena is so unique, when all around them is a troubled community of impoverished and dispossessed people. When I go to San Marino, Arcadia, Sierra Madre, La Canada, and South Pasadena, I don't see groups of the dispossessed milling around liquor stores, Arco gas stations, and payday loan stores; or engaging in drug use or drug dealing out in the open. You only see that in low income areas like Altadena. So nonsense to the claims that Altadena is a upper middle to high income area.

In order to write our business plan, I've recently studied the demographics on Altadena. The figures Daniel used are older. According to my research, the population of Altadena (46,000+ people as of two years ago), is solidly in the mid to upper range of salary levels. 80% of the employed population makes over $80,000.00 per year. We are a town comprised mostly of educators, doctors, administrators and executives.

That said, there is a component of our population that are at or below the poverty level, as in almost every city or town in the United States. The fact that there is a proliferation of check cashing places and payday advances is simply because they're everywhere, except those cities that outlaw them.....these are chains whose corporate offices see an opportunity in this economic downturn.

RiteAid is a chain so not a local business, independently owned and operated. Their profits don't recirculate back into the community as locally owned businesses do. They can offer lower price points because they are a chain and have the buying power of such. If I were buying for 1500 shops across the country, I'd get a better wholesale price, too.....but I'm not. But try asking them to do something different than what their corporate rules & regs state and you wouldn't have any luck.

Scott and I are always available to discuss what you'd like to see us carry. Know that we care very deeply about what happens here.

Altadena DOES look like a low-income area. There are far too many liquor stores, check cashing shops, churches and run-down, dirty storefronts.

Another problem is that many of the independent businesses are not sufficiently-stocked or well merchandised. I dropped by the hardware store the other day to purchase batteries and they were out of stock. I was told that they would be available in just over one week. Should I wait one week, so I can shop local?

Further, many Altadena businesses seem to be out of touch with the people who live in their community. On my block (west of Fair Oaks) of about 30 households, all but 2 are younger middle to high income families. The parents are hip and stylish. Unfortunately, much of the merchandise in many of Altadena's retailers appears to be geared toward senior citizens and people of modest means.

When I want to purchase greeting cards and gifts, I drive down Vroman's and other businesses with fresh, fun, colorful, bold, funky and even irreverent cards and gifts. When I shop for food, I drive to Trader Joe's or Sprouts in Pasadena where I can get good, quality food.

The restaurant scene, with the exception of Amy's Patio Cafe and El Patron, is dismal as well. Most of the eating establishments, I wouldn't even consider walking into because of their dirty, dated and cheap exteriors.

Perception is reality.

Do you all see the conundrum here? We have one writer who thinks the locally-owned and operated stores are too expensive and the other thinks that they're too low class. Where is the happy medium here?

Speaking for our store, I can say that we're offering a good balance of quality merchandise for your home and office. Here you can find ecologically and socially responsible fashion accessories, paper, notecards, greeting cards, local artists' jewelry, local authors' books, decor, and we look for products sourced locally or made in the US. We are Altadena's only Crane & Co. retailer. Marilee, please come see me instead of driving down into Pasadena, you might be surprised.

As for being out of stock on a certain item.....please, people, understand that there's been a recession going on here. For the past 3 years, our local businesses have been scrambling to make their payroll, taxes, utility bills and rent. When shopping slows down and people aren't buying, the stores aren't making as much and they don't have as much to put into inventory. Especially hurtful for independent businesses, as we don't have the extensive corporate backing the chain-stores have. In other words, I can't pull profits from another store to fill the one that's hurting.

What we all need is some understanding and support. The businesses need you to patronize them so they'll have the wherewithal to accomplish beautification and to beef up their stock. Talk to us....we're listening!

Lisa, our shipping department charges $.50 for a tape up job for dropped-off, prepaid packages. Most days we get a truck full of dropped-off packages and a good majority of them aren't taped at all or aren't taped correctly. With that said, however, our volume isn't anywhere near that of The UPS Store or FedEx Kinkos, who take in thousands per week. . Those corporate chain stores make up in drop-off fees (UPS pays $1.00 per pkg, FedEx pays $.75) what they expend on tape. Those payments made to us, plus our $.50 tape charge, go toward payroll for our excellent crew members, the accompanying employment taxes, and products like tape. I wish we had enough volume to offer free taping on dropped off packages, but the reality is that we do not.....yet. Maybe at some point we will and then we can drop the tape charge. Until then, however, the tape charge stands and it seems that most of our customers don't mind it.....they realize that the box they're dropping off should have been taped up beforehand, at home. Happily, we sell tape, though, so you can buy some to tape up your next package before you drop it off.

Lisa, I'm sorry to hear you that you feel I was being sarcastic when I meant every word. I'm also concerned that you consider our fifty cent tape charge poor customer service. Enlighten me, please, about why you would threaten to damage our reputation over something so trivial?

How sad this is? You know, I used to ride a Honda motorcycle and guys would say to me, I'd rather push a Harley than ride a rice burner. On Sundays, those guys would be in their garages, fixing their Harleys while I was out riding. Their choice.

My time is worth more than 50 cents so, driving down to Pasadena because I don't want buy tape and tape up my own package and don't want to have someone local to it... incredibly sad. Her choice.

What's going on here, trying to convince one whiner that Webster's is as good as any comparable place in Pasadena is like herding cats. Not going to happen. Leave the woman to her otherness and move on. I've rarely had better service anywhere than at Websters. They have some of the most unique items...friendly personnel... what more can one ask for? Problem I see is, if people don't go in and see for themselves... they think it's just "fine stationary" they carry. It's not. Go there! See for yourself... meet Lori and Scott and their crew and browse the aisles. If you don't see what you want or don't see something you most likely wont find anywhere else... ask!

I hear so many people complaining about Altadena. Yanno what? don't like it ~ MOVE! Make room for those of us who do!

What I would like to see? Restaurants. I was out patrolling Saturday evening and, not being a meat eater... not many choices ~ none, in fact. Also, I also go to TJ's and Sprouts for my groceries ~ as well as Kings. So, a good food market here on the east side would be very welcome.

~ Revvell ~

The median income of Altadena's poorest CT (4610) is $11,000 higher than the median income for Pasadena. The median income over in the northeast is some $25,000 higher than San Rafael...The whole Altadena as a poor community bit is disinformation spread by the City of Pasadena. Yes there are some poor people here, but e3ven our poor are more well off than Pasadenas. The big secret is that Altadena should be the shopping powerhouse but because Pasadena has a city and does spend money it collects on taxes, it can control the message. The County could do this but they wont.

Hard to change shopping habits? I remember when NO ONE wanted to go to old town. Pasadena SPENT SOME MONEY to market it and revive it and EVERYBODY drives to there from all over to shop and for every buck Pasadena put in twenty years ago they get ten every year......

as a member of Altadena MOMS Club who has over 60 members and also RIPE (that wonderful food swapping group of Altadena), those coupons never came across my computer. While our membership may not be whopping, we certainly spread the news fast to friends and family. You get the idea. While much of Altadena IS middle/upper class, I'd agree, you'd never know by most of the storefronts (liquor, check cashing, and those ever increasing church fronts--really, don't we have enough of those?). Where is our Trader Joes (I get it, it's a larger "chain" but probably half of Altadena treks over to either Hastings Ranch of La Canada to shop there and then of course do all their incidentals at shops nearby). Local stores like Websters just doesn't pop into mind when you need something small while you're out shopping for the bulk of life.

I'm not a shop owner, I'm not a council member, just a resident who wishes we could clean up Altadena, make it look like the quaint city we all envision it to be. The loss of Kat Scrap and the art gallery just plummets it even lower. What a prime location Kat Scrap had...and now the "beautiful" Curves sign will take up residence. ugh. I often dream of mariposa and lake line with boutique, bistro w/tables, soda fountain, book store.....we can dream can't we? then I might remember that I can just walk down to Websters to buy that card after having a cappuccino.

Nina- The reason we dont have a business community of bistros is that the C0unty of Los Angeles wont allow it. Altadenas business districts were all built by the 1920's in 1979 the County imposed modern parking standards on all the Altadena business District and no one can complt here. ANOTHER THING KILLING LOCAL BUSINESS is the LACSD threatening and intimidating the customers of African American owned businesses. This came out in a community meeting last week sponsored by the Altadena Town Council between the new LACSD Captain and the Community.......

Oh please. What nonsense!

What does parking standards have to do with people creating small boutiques or having a TJ's or something comparable come in on that empty lot next to Ralph's? There are a LOT of empty buildings, on Lake where there could be boutique bistros, book stores, clothing boutiques, etc. There's always parking behind Webster's and, walking is good for us. Nail shops, hair salons, check cashing services don't seem to have a problem so, I don't think you can blame the county.

I don't live on the west side yet, as a Volunteer on Patrol who goes out with the deputies, I've yet to see any of the businesses "threatened" or "intimidate". The barber shop next to The Coffee Gallery is constantly busy. Are they threatened and intimidated by the LASD? Maybe I'll chat with DL next time I see him ~ which is pretty much every day.

Excuse me? The Parking standards imposed by the County and the way they are waived COMPLETELY controls all business in Altadena. If you had ever say applied to open one, or done the drawings for one, or sat on the Land Use Committee or sat through years of its meetings you would know this.

And if you had attended last weeks meeting with our Captain, you would know there was testimony that citizens have been intimidated on a regular basis by the LACSD and kept from shopping in Black owned business. It was taped. Since you missed it, you should go get a copy of the tape.

I see DL every day, and his business does not get messed with very often, but there are according to the testimony at the meeting, many who do.

Yeah, and you're probably holding court at The Coffee Gallery as you type blowing hot air.

OUR Captain? Wow! You've got NOTHING good to say about Altadena, the LASD or anything else. All you do is gripe, Steve. Why do you stay? Is there ANYThing good about Altadena?

As far as what people say... well, we've all got our opinions; we've all got our stories and very often they are exaggerated.

Sure, some businesses have been pinpointed as gang hangouts. The good people in that area would like to be rid of the gangs so they can live in peace. THOSE people are afraid to come out and say "thanks for all you're doing" because of GANG intimidation and I'm not talking about the folks wearing badges.

Here's what I suggest Steve ~ ask to do some ride-alongs. Get a different viewpoint. You're coming from one side only. See what's REALLY happening there. What I see and what you see... different because I see from the inside. I wanted to know BOTH sides, not just one. What about you?

I live in Altadena, in a 2 million dollar home in a neighborhood chock a block with two million dollar homes. I used to live in Madison Heights in Pasadena, but I got so sick of the gentrification, the generic big box stores, everything cut from the same Pottery Barn cookie cutters, the "we can't afford Silverlake , so we'll come here and buy up a cheap little house", hipsters.

Everyone moves here because they can't afford to live west of the 5, and then complain because
Altadena isn't hip enough because it caters to people who have lived here for 30 years?

Please, no TJ's. Get behind the Altadena Food Co-op, or the new Farmers Market. . Come to Foxes with my hipster film business family and our friends who just moved here from London, with the lovely senior gentleman, who all the waitresses know by name, and the table of ladies just come from church.
It's diverse, colorful and friendly.

I am so glad that the house across the street is rather modest little house, that my neighborhood is diverse, that it is not only populated by affluent, white hipsters. I am glad that my children are growing up in a community that is ethnically and economically diverse. This ain't Calabasas.

I will shop local whenever I can, and smile every time I drive through Lake and Mariposa, and remain grateful that I live in a town that still has small ordinary shops.
Grateful there is no Z Galerie or lousy Old Town restaurants.

That said we could really use a good place to eat dinner.

Let's get those coupons into the mailboxes!!!!!!!!!

Couldn't find the coupons on the Chamber's website - maybe I missed it...hmm... I was looking because I would gladly send them out via e-mail to the 170+ members of my RIPE Altadena group.
I totally agree with Nina, the small groups do pass info along, and we all know someone else who is not part of the group to share with too. And what about including Altadena's Women's Network? Don't any of you business owners belong to any of these small groups? The people that I meet in them are far from the poverty level - or they cover it well. And Terry is right too - why aren't hundreds more people joining the effort to bring a co-op to Altadena? I know that I have joined the Arroyo Food Co-Op, and I'd bet that Revvell and Nina have too (knowing them).
Websters! When I lived in Pasadena I used to come up to Websters to buy office supplies that the big chains did not even carry but Websters did. I don't know what to say, because as much as I love them, it hasn't been the same since the division - you know, since "The Walls"! I still shop there though just not as much as "before The Walls." The division prevents me from lingering and looking through the adjoining Webster stores. I'm sure they have lost some of my money because I am too lazy to go out one door and in the other. This isn't a conscience laziness, I just go and get what I need and leave that particular store. It sure used to be more fun before though!

All:

The Shop Altadena merchant coupons are here:
http://abacus-es.com/altadena/

Home page under "Merchant Coupons"..... page 1 & 2.

Thanks,
Ed

Hello business people and the Chamber: Perhaps you should change your game plan! What is it that makes a community? A sense of history is one. OUT OF THE BOX THINKING? O.K. I'm a tutor so I go to the educational bent, but think.... do the citizens of this town even know of all the wonderful history? Ms. Zack has provided lots of info, but where is out community knowledge?

Forget coupons, and go back to Groucho and "Say the secret word ( answer) idea and get % off. Run a monthy question and save the paper. Each store will have a sign on entering, Say the secret ANSWER and save! Find the QUESTION first and it's on a sign somewhere in the store! The answer is right next to the question. Example? YES! Who showed up in Altadena to test his car on the 8% grade of Lake Ave? Henry Ford....( wow, did you know that?)
A little knowledge is a wonderful thing! Besides, in order to have a community, one must know its history, the good , the bad, and the ugly! ( even the silly!) Painless and fun learning for the whole family, PLUS you get a discount. A monthly fact? How hard could that be? It saves paper and gets people talking. Isn't that the beginning of a "functional democracy?"

Nina, most of us business owners in the North Lake area are working very hard to understand what our community members would like to see here in our community. We can work toward those goals together, and communication is key.

Terry, what a refreshing attitude, thank you! The Arroyo Food Co-op is a great group and one we've been promoting since their inception. You can find their information on our Community Table at our store. Once they're up and running, I'm certain they'll be a valuable resource for Altadena. And while I agree that Altadena isn't Calabasas or West LA, there's no reason we can't have an updated business/retail district on Lake & Mariposa. Unfortunately, this recession, along with the diversity in opinion about it, has really made it hard to accomplish.

Gail, I am indeed a member of the Altadena Women's Network, and Monica is a former member of the Chamber of Commerce. It's a great idea to let her know about the coupons....thank you. Many of us in the Chamber are also members of other groups, so we'll pass along the coupon information to them and they can disseminate the information as they see fit. I'm sorry you feel that the "walls at Webster's" keep you from shopping at all the stores. Actually, the number of people who are wandering into our store while waiting for their prescriptions have increased recently, so maybe that "ennui" about going in and out of the shops is waning. I can only hope.

Gloriana, what fabulous ideas you have! I wonder if you've ever visited our website, at http://www.webstersfs.com, and seen our "About Us" page. There we give a little history of Altadena and Webster's. I also wonder if you've ever visited our Facebook fan page, where we run contests and have special percentages off for our members? We also periodically post historical pictures of the "old Webster's"....very nostalgic and fun! You might try looking us up and joining in the fun...we're up to around 640 fans so far.

We have fun events about once a month, as well. Last one was right before Thanksgiving, when Anne Bannon and Michael Holland, local wine experts and bloggers, led a tasting of this year's Beaujolais Nouveau. Local author Hugh Bonar was there signing his book "Avalon" and we had a wonderful time! We hope to include more exciting surprises in the future.

We need a fabulous destination store to go into the Kit Kat space. Great shop, but the only people using it were crafters. There are so many great things that could go in there.
A soda fountain!
A bakery like Little Flower Candy Company. You can barely get a table there
A beautiful little corner grocery, one that would carry fresh Altadena eggs, cheese from Altadena goats, good bread, fresh milk, good quality vegetables, not a big fancy gourmet emporium, something small and good. A place to stop on the way home when you need to pick up bread and milk, something other then Ralph or Vons !!!!!!!!
(and a good old fashioned butcher shop in the empty shop at the other end of the block)

There needs to be a place that people either need or really, want to go to. Once they are there, they will go to the hardware, the pharmacy, and the stationery store. The store that everyone goes to, and then all the surrounding stores benefit.

These kinds of old fashioned stores are opening all over the country, in San Francisco, Brooklyn. People are looking for small, comforting, neighborhoods where they can access
a world that no longer exists. Been to Eagle Rock or Sierra Madre lately? That place is jumping!

I wish the Food Coop would go ahead and open, start small, and then expand into one of the countless larger spaces that are opening up. But people would come from all over Altadena and
Pasadena for that. Just one fabulous shop would change EVERYTHING.

Not to ramble, but Bulgarini Gelato is a good case in point.
There they are in that horrible Auto Zone mall, and on any given weekend the lot is full of expensive cars, that aren't going there for auto parts!
That place gets written up all over the country, in the NY Times, in all the food magazines, and there it sits in that awful location. Still, they come for the movies and the fantastic product.
Go on Chowhound.com, type in Pasadena and read all the people talking about how bad Pasadena restaurants are.
But everyone is going to Zelo pizza in Sierra Madre. It makes Jonathan Gold's 1000 best list this year!
It will just take one good SOPHISTICATED restaurant (Lazy Ox in Downtown, Little Flower),
and Altadena will thrive. Not a white tablecloth place, that is old school right now, something modern. Build it and they will come.

@ Leslie- what do they want a Sq Ft?

Mr. Gold could do us all a favor and help find someone to open there... I suggest a Vietnamese place, a kind of food EVERYONE loves.

EVERYONE Vietnamese food? You're kidding, right? I've never even HAD Vietnamese food.

It seems people ARE requesting more fresh, healthier food though... not so much fried... with vegetarian options....

Pho, egg rolls, spring rolls, shrimp, all easy to make, full of herbs, mostly good for you, but it doesnt taste like that awful boring health food drek and Revvell you should go to Golden Deli in San Gabriel and get you some good Vietnamese food. The stuff is the BOMB. Yeah I wish I had that operators number too who was leasing the Ryen. He was EXCELLENT. Except for the Pho people I'vce been to the Ryen like less than six times in fifty years, and I went to the Pho people about six times when they were open. The Ryen is good straight ahead merican food, but I go to Fox's or Fair Oaks Burger for that.

Thanks for the referral Steve yet, I prefer that un-boring, "health food drek".

The easiest way I've found to be healthy is with a plant-based diet... that doesn't include fried spring rolls or dead animals. Now, the spring rolls might be worth the trip. What else they got w/out being fried, or containing dead animal carcasses?

Here are some links to some of that "boring health food drek" ~

http://www.rawmazing.com/recipes/basil-and-raw-food-expanded/
http://www.rawmazing.com/recipes/raw-food-blts/
http://www.rawmazing.com/recipes/savory-squash-crepes-with-sage-cream-sauce/
http://www.rawmazing.com/recipes/white-chocolate-dark-chocolate-raspberry-tart/
http://www.rawmazing.com/recipes/lemon-glazed-fruit-cloud/

Enjoy!

~ Revvell ~

Hey all if you have not yet taken it please go over to http://surveyaltadena.com/ and take the business survey, we will publish the results in about a month or so and it will be interesting.

Daniel

Hi Lori at Websters:
I love your shop and come frequently . In fact, when my neighbor had visited Kenya, he brought me some beautiful hand carved pens. When the ink tubes ran out, the people in your store went out of their way to find ink refills which could match the pens' unique size. Thank you for saving my beutiful pens! I also found beautiful stationery in your store , and sent a poem to the White House, and I got a wonderful reply. They have beautiful stationery too!
Sorry, but I think of Facebook as the plague of non-personal communiction; yes, I am a minority, but I will go to your website to see the pictures and comments. I didn't know you had this, so thanks! I always go to Websters first and most of the time I find have exactly what I want. I do try to support local business as much as I can, because I don't want to live in a ghost town. There are real "nuggets" here, people of Altadena, so start mining!

Gloriana, thank you so much for your kind words! This is what a community store is all about and we thank you for support.